Re: [Stoves] Bulk density of LPG vs pellets


; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; word-spacing:0px; background-color:rgb(255,255,255); float:none; display:inline”>How much energy can be transported in each delivery trip, and which becomes the most economical”?

It doesn’t matter a hoot what the empty mass of the tank is. The cost is what the carrier charges, and there is no reason to presume that every carrier charges per kg of weight for everything. 

It helps to do some contextual inquiry and damn the theory. 

I don’t understand what you mean by losing the cost advantage if the transported wood is turned into char. The user can do whatever s/he wants. Again, damn the theory; simply inquire. Observe. Experiment – as in examining different alternatives for shipping volume and frequency, inventory management, and consumer preferences. (It is cheaper to make char at the user end if s/he wants to use the offgases for cooking and store the car, sell the char, or put the char in the soil. What problem do you have with these? 

Nikhil


————————————————————————
Nikhil Desai
(US +1) 202 568 5831
Skype: nikhildesai888

On 13 Feb 2018 9:46 pm, “Crispin Pemberton-Pigott” <crispinpigott@outlook.com> wrote:

Dear Paul

 

Perhaps you could consider transporting torrefied pellets instead of raw wood (21 MJ/kg). Not only is it more energy per ton, it is more likely not to be damaged by moisture. That link has some interesting info BTW.

You can guess that the LPG (46 MJ/kg) is about 2.7 times the energy of the pellets (17 MJ/kg), however the empty mass of the tank is about equal to the gas contents. Thus the energy content per transported kg is only 1.35 times that of the wood.

In terms of cost the wood should be cheaper, delivered.

If you are turning the wood into char and not burning it, the cost advantage will be lost. I presume you have a plan to offset that.

 

Regards
Crispin

 

 

—–Original Message—–
From: Stoves [mailto:stoves-bounces@lists.bioenergylists.org] On Behalf Of Paul Anderson
Sent: 13-Feb-18 10:15
To: Stoves and biofuels network <Stoves@lists.bioenergylists.org>
Subject: [Stoves] Bulk density of LPG vs pellets

 

Dear Stovers and friends,

 

I hope that someone can provide an answer to this question:

 

The situation:  A fuel for cooking needs to be transported to communities in somewhat remote locations.   There are roads that at least allow a pickup truck to go in and out year-round.  The people have access to locally sources woody biomass fuel, but are interested in having some better stoves with processed fuels.   In particular, they are considering LPG in standard bottles/tanks that are brought in full, and empties are taken back.    They are also considering  pellets that are in typical 40 pound (~18 kg) bags, with local sales in smaller quanties.   Consider initially that the pellets are made in the same location where the LPG bottles are refilled.  (We can consider different distances of transport later, if of interest).  (also, there will be some differences if different sizes of LPG bottles or pellets in super-sacks are used, but that is not of much interest in this initial

discussion.)

 

The question:  How much energy can be transported in each delivery trip, and which becomes the most economical — or are they about the same? The LPG has more energy per kg of fuel, but must be transported in metal containers that are cylindrircal and occupy much space.   The pelelts are in bags that can be stacked (such as on a pallet of pellets).

 

Boilse down to:   LPG in bottles vs pellets in sacks.

 

My thanks to everyone who contributes to answering this question.

 

Paul

 

Doc  /  Dr TLUD  /  Prof. Paul S. Anderson, PhD

Email:  psanders@ilstu.edu

Skype:   paultlud    Phone: +1-309-452-7072

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